Teach Middle East Podcast
Welcome to the Teach Middle East Podcast, the ultimate audio hub where educators find inspiration, share innovative ideas, and grow together! Brought to you by Moftah Publishing—the minds behind the premier Teach Middle East Magazine—this podcast is your gateway to the latest research-based practices, cutting-edge classroom strategies, and the heartwarming stories of educators from the Middle East and around the globe.
As the only podcast that interviews school leaders from across the Middle East and beyond, we offer unparalleled insights into the challenges and successes that shape educational landscapes in diverse settings. Join us as we dive deep into the fascinating world of education, where every episode promises a treasure trove of insights designed to connect, develop, and empower the brilliant minds shaping our future. Whether you’re seeking fresh perspectives, practical tips, or a dose of inspiration, the Teach Middle East Podcast is your must-listen resource. Tune in and transform the way you teach!
Teach Middle East Podcast
Educating with Heart: Nargish Khambatta's Vision for Joyful, Holistic Learning
This enlightening episode explores Nargish Khambatta's remarkable journey from a quaint Indian town to leading Dubai's Gems Modern Academy. Her deep-rooted passion for learning and dedicated pursuit of 'Ikigai' – where profession meets passion – forms the crux of our conversation. Nargish shares her experiences of adapting to life in Dubai, her rise to educational leadership, and the guiding principles of her educational philosophy.
Delving into her personal life, she reveals how yoga, beach walks, and family intertwine with her professional responsibilities, emphasising the harmony between personal well-being and professional ambition. Nargish also discusses the importance of emotional intelligence in children's development and the need for a slower pace in our fast-moving world.
The episode also touches upon the integration of traditional teaching methods with modern technology, highlighting her vision for a future where education is joyful, personalised, and centres on student happiness. Join us for this intimate look into the heart of a visionary educator's world.
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Hosted by Leisa Grace Wilson
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Hi everyone, welcome to Behind the Principles Desk a series here on the Teach Middle East podcast. My name is Lisa Grace and today I have with me Nargish Lombarda, a Kambarda. See, I knew I was going to do that and I'm not going to edit this out. It's Nargish Kambarda, principle of Gems Modern Academy in Dubai. It is my pleasure to have her here because we are going to be going behind her desk to learn more about her. What makes her tick? Who is she? Who is this wonderful lady that I hear so much about? Thank you for joining me on this podcast, Nargish.
Speaker 2:My pleasure, lisa, and I'm really pleased to be here. I mean it's I've seen you on LinkedIn and I've seen shout outs to you, so here, listen, happy to be here.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much. I love chatting to principles, you know it's. It's so refreshing, especially doing this series, because I have learned so much about the people who are running the schools and I think sometimes, when parents are looking for schools, or when even teachers are looking to join schools, they never get a chance to ask these questions, so they never get to learn about who are these people, what do they like, what don't they like? So let's kick off. Where are you from? Where did you grow up? How did you end up in Dubai?
Speaker 2:So before that, I often get this whenever I have parents coming to my office for the first time and they say, you know, mrs Kambarda, I used to dread going into the principal's office when I was in school and I'm getting that feeling right now and I smile and they say am I, am I in trouble? And I say the principal's office is not like it used to be 15, 20 years ago. It's a more open door policy, it's a it's so much warmer and friendlier conversation, not because anything has changed, but I think because that's what the 21st century student demands and that's what we apply to. So back to your question, lisa where am I from? How did I land up in Dubai? I come actually from a very small contentment called Debalali in Maharashtra in India and I was privileged to grow up in a school where they gave equal importance to extracurricular. I remember getting on my cycle at 5.30 in the morning and cycling up so we would call the school on the hill the Bansai School Debalali started by the East India Company in 1800 and something and cycling all the way up on that hill because I used to go for hockey practice or whatever gymnastics or whatever practice I was going for in the morning. So, along with academics, there was a lot of focus on extracurricular. And I come from a large family with nine brothers and sisters. I'm number eight and we all went to the same school. So, yeah, it was that's where I grew up. How did I come to Dubai? So I actually loved where I grew up. I love the neighborhood, I love my friends, I love just the home I grew up in.
Speaker 2:As a young girl I never wanted to leave Debalali. I thought I'm going to grow old and this is where I'm going to be all my life. And then I met my husband and I think that was the time when everything was so different and so new, and so it happened so quickly. And when we moved, I was lecturing in a college, in the Sophia College in Mumbai. I was lecturing, teaching microbiology, and when I came here to Dubai, my husband moved here first and I came to earn the petrodollars. We thought we'd stay here for two years, maximum five, but stayed on. It's been a journey Started at the Arab Unity School here as a biology teacher because the universities here required a PhD and I didn't have a PhD at that time, and so we've been in and out, been in Dubai started off in 1987 when Dubai was growing and moved out. After seven years went to Oman, came back to Dubai, went to India at the Dune School, deradun, for six years and then came back to Dubai. So I've been around.
Speaker 1:What is your secret to looking so young? You just said to me you came here with your husband in 1987. As a young bride, I'm just thinking 1987. I was born. Come on, come on, don't, don't do that. I was born. But I was very young, I don't, I don't, I wasn't in secondary school yet. Oh my, come on Talk. Talk to me about skin routine. What are we doing every morning to keep so fresh?
Speaker 2:No, I am bad with makeup and skin routines. I have to be honest here. So it's just usually the the L'Oreal cream. That's it, and it's what a lipstick. Nothing more.
Speaker 1:Really you look amazing. Tell me about diet, then. What are we having that's keeping keeping you looking so lush?
Speaker 2:No, so I think it's just the joy and the love for what I do. I think that's what helps me. I do yoga, that's. That's a different thing every morning. 15 minutes of yoga, that's it. I do a headstand every morning, if that surprises you. Yeah, I think just I think this I found my Eiki guy. It's taken me a little while to do it, but I found my Eiki guy and I think every morning I come with a sense of purpose and that energy of purpose and when I come to school, I think I think it's my responsibility to make sure that, you know, everyone's happy, everyone's doing what they meant to do, whatever it is. When I saw love, my job. I don't see it as a job. I feel I'm blessed, I get paid to do what I love and that's it.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. I wonder as well, when you talked about Eiki guy, if you could just expand a little bit more about how you came to realizing that what you're doing as a school leader is indeed your Eiki guy.
Speaker 2:So I actually never wanted or dreamt of being in school leadership at all and I was very happy being biology teacher and environment teacher and I just love challenging my students, listening to their dreams, you know, working with them. Whichever school I was in, and then of course, at the Dune School, they recognize something in me and put me on the spot, gave me a really, really big job to do it well and that's how I came here. But I think so I also worked in an organization which had nothing to do with education and that was a short time when I was expecting my baby, and I still remember that the general manager met me and said, nargis, the day you stabilize and remain in one place because I was, you know, because the job was such my husband's job was moving around he said, the day you stabilize, you will grow. And I never took his word seriously. I said, okay, I mean, I just I was just enjoying life, you know, helping my child grow and, you know, being a full time mom and doing something on the side while he was at nursery.
Speaker 2:And and I think the longer I stayed at a place, the more I felt connected with the purpose of what I was doing and realized that I am having an impact on lives. It started out by being young lives, but children, but you know teachers around me and, of course, when you're in a leadership capacity as principal of a school or a senior vice president, which I am at this point serving five schools within the gems network, I think when you see the positive impact you're able to have, what you're able to enable, I think that makes such a difference. And so somebody asked me the other day you don't have a problem sleeping. And I said no, the moment my head hits the pillow I'm like a light and I wake up in the morning when it's time to get up. So, yeah, that's, I think I've said on my sense of purpose in being able to be an enabler for others and seeing the positive impact I can have. Yeah, and I love that.
Speaker 1:Amazing. How many kids do you have?
Speaker 2:I have a son who's 33 and a daughter who's 30. Sons in Canada and my daughter's here in Dubai with me.
Speaker 1:So, as a mom, how do you ensure like even when you were raising them, how did you ensure that you gave them as much of you as you could while still working on your career? How did you balance that?
Speaker 2:You know it's strange you say that and I'm going to try and find an email I sent to so. Every every Saturday, I write an email to my staff and I've been doing that for the last, I think, eight years now, and now I've moved on from writing to all staff, to the leadership team, and, and that's one of the things that I address to them, and I'll try and I'll try and email it to you. But this is exactly what I said, you know, in its time, in its place, and and, and I, as a mom, was very clear that I wanted to give. So I nursed my children, I breastfed my children for one year, both of them. I felt it's important to do that, and and that that was what I felt. I'm not saying that's the right thing to do, but I felt that was the right thing to do and that's what I did. It gave me really good quality time with the kids Wherever I was, wherever they were studying. I was a teacher in that school and they went with me in the car and they came with me in the car and we talked about their day in school and you know the dreams and aspirations and competitions and all of that. Holidays and we planned holidays together.
Speaker 2:So I think the difficult bit was when we were traveling so much in the UAE I mean, I'm sorry, not new we were traveling around my husband's job to come to Saudi and a few other places and I said enough is enough, we need stability.
Speaker 2:So I told my husband, I said you know, I'm going to go back to India, to the Dune school, which is the Eaton of the East consider the Eaton of the East and I said I'm going to teach there and the kids will be with me and you can come down twice a year and I'll come down twice a year. That'll be good for the barrage as well and we'll you know the kids will be happy and and we'll be in one place. And being in a new place, it was difficult for me because it was absolutely a new place, a new culture, a new everything For the children. It took some time for them to adjust as well, but I thought those were the best years of our lives because it gave us such quality time. It was a boarding school. The children lived with me on campus. There's so many things to do. I've forgotten your question actually.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I was asking how you managed to do the career piece and the mothering piece, but you are answering. You're answering it because, within your role as a teacher, you kept them with you. So I think it was a little bit different. It's a little bit different for you than maybe, say, someone who works in the corporate sector or works in hospitality, etc. I think your career lends itself a little bit easier to being more present as a mom.
Speaker 2:Yes, it does.
Speaker 2:And, like I wrote in that email to my staff, I said, you know, in its time, in its place, I said some of us have the pulls and tugs of looking after our parents or aging parents or in-laws, and it's a privilege to do that.
Speaker 2:And if there's no house help, then you know you need to focus on that. If, when your kids are growing up, if you've got a supportive spouse and you've got help at home and you've got someone to take care of the kids, then by all means be ambitious and focus on your career. Otherwise there'll be such a pull and tug and you'd be rather happy here and all that so, and you're always going to feel shortchanged and you know. So I think it's good to be ambitious, but also to have the time and space to enable that ambition and if you don't have it, then to manage your expectations and to slow it down, because I think it's not a race. Leadership is to get to a leadership position is really not a race. And if you're getting there too early at the cost and you know, sacrificing so many other, including relationships, is it worth. It Is the question asked.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, it's a good question to ask, and when it comes on to taking care of yourself, you mentioned yoga. You do 15 minutes of yoga in the morning. What else do you do to really make sure that Nargis is okay?
Speaker 2:So I think I think I've been blessed with a good disposition in terms of I don't get angry easily, I am pretty calm, I'm happy. It doesn't take much to make me happy. I don't take this the lift in school, I only use the stairs wherever I go and I try to have walking meetings. So I think the physical, emotional, spiritual aspect, if that's taken care of so physically, I watch what I eat. Even staff lunch in school is mainly salads with, you know, a lentil and some rice on the side for all staff in the school. So we try and get these healthy habits in. Like I said, use the lift, have walking meetings. With very large campus, you must come, lisa, and spend some time with us. We'd love to show you around and walk around with you, but so I think that's on the physical side, that's what keeps me going.
Speaker 2:I'm not a gym person but I like walks and I like my, my time alone. You know reflecting as I walk, and I think some of my best ideas come when I go for long walks and I stay with the thought for a while and I think that's that's really me time for me. I love going to the beach, so on a weekend when my husband sees me going to the beach, he says I know you need some time to yourself. So I think that's that's for me the best time when I'm, when I leave early in the morning, go to the beach and and just sit down there and enjoy the calm. And spiritually, you know, I like to lamp every day. I do pray and I'm not overly so, what's the word I'm looking at? I'm not overly religious. I'm not high on, you know, rituals no, I'm not. But I like to lamp, I like the energy of the flame. So yeah, emotionally I try to. So.
Speaker 2:As a kid I used to be a little anxious at times, really, but I know what anxiety feels like. So when I see children having a meltdown or when they're being anxious, I know the feeling and I'm. I haven't cracked it yet, but I keep trying to figure out. What did I do to keep it in check? I still haven't found the answer. I think when children, when you talk to children and they understand that adults also have anxious moments and it's not part of life, I think they're able to handle their, their emotions, a little better. But emotional regulation, I think, is an executive function, and I used to be in betchers. I used to be impulsive, but I think long past that and I think it's taken me a little time. But but I'm in a happy place.
Speaker 1:I think that. So I know you. You just talked about being a very calm person by nature, but what makes you angry? What in the world, what situations, what do you see around you that actually makes you angry?
Speaker 2:So I think I'll talk about the school later, but I think injustice is something that I've always felt upset about. It angers me to see injustice on in any form and and if you want to beat me, demonstrate injustice. I want to say this to my team and when I see it in action, I can't help but respond and, you know, want to correct it when I see it. But for the children I get not angry, but I feel society has forced people to be overly competitive and I think you know when children are robbed of their childhood by the over competitiveness of the environment, then I think that's a sad thing and I think, as far as the world goes today, all of us are, if we're almost on a on a hamster wheel and everybody is rushing and hurtling and trying to get everything crammed in. So I think that sometimes why are we not able to take a step back and breathe and relax and just enjoy life?
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I'm with you with that. And if you were to work on a cause so let's say you are no longer a school leader and you're into philanthropy or you're into charity work what would your cause be and why?
Speaker 2:So I think it would be for the elderly in society and I think they sometimes get neglected because of the fast pace at which society keeps itself running and I do think the elderly and I think there's a place for children and adults mingling.
Speaker 2:There is an educator called Sugata Mitra I don't know if you've heard of this you have, yes. So he's quite an amazing educator and he started Granny's in the Cloud because he said that there's so much of wisdom in our grandparents and he said that at some point they just society tends to marginalize them and he said why don't we draw on them? There are so many children, there are orphans, there are neglected children. Why don't we combine the wisdom of the grannies and those who need it and get something magical out of it? And so he started a program called Granny's in the Cloud where children can reach out to grandparents who volunteer their time. I thought that's so beautiful and I think, if I were to have the dream retired life, I'd love to be in a community where I'm bringing the elderly in, drawing them in and getting children in and just reconnecting the two extremes of generations that we have.
Speaker 1:Amazing, I actually like that. See. This is why we have these conversations, because I would have never thought that that would be your answer. I thought maybe you would have said, oh, I would do a program for kids and talk to them about, I don't know, the environment or leadership or something, but to bring the elderly into society and to embrace them and to garner from them the wisdom that they would have gained over the years is pretty special. I wanted to kind of go a little bit whimsical with you. So if you were to plan a dinner date with your husband, where would you go? What kind of cuisine would you have? What would you choose to do?
Speaker 2:So that would depend whether I want to please him or please myself, because they're two different things.
Speaker 1:OK, if you were pleasing him first, what would it be? And then, if you were pleasing yourself, what would it be?
Speaker 2:So if I were pleasing him, I'd probably go into a really nice soft, romantic setting candlelight dinner, good music playing, fine dining. That's his style and I enjoy that. It's not that I don't, but that's not my first choice. But if it was me, I'd probably pack a picnic basket and go into the desert or go to the beach or just watch a movie. You know, popcorn and movie and movie night yeah, those are all if he's really so he or probably take him skydiving or good, you know the planning, or something like that. Yeah, that excites me.
Speaker 1:So you're more of the adventure type.
Speaker 2:He's done so much of it in his youth that now that doesn't excite him anymore. But for me I've not done too much of that, so now I'm more of the adventure some years.
Speaker 1:Oh, I get it. And in terms of travel, what's on your wishlist? Where would you like to go and why?
Speaker 2:Oh, my goodness, yeah. So I think Fernwees is a calling for me. I love travel and my husband teases me about it. He says it'll take nothing to help me get you to pack your bag and get on. But I like either a spiritual holiday or an adventure holiday. I don't like a La Lida five star holiday. That's not me. So I recently went for a round square conference to Kenya and we had the most amazing, amazing seven days there. It was fabulous, Of course, based on Curt Hans philosophy. I mean, the round square itself is an amazing movement, but just to have 1,300 educators globally, from I don't know how many schools, 58 schools, was a fantastic experience in going out for the safaris and the adventure, et cetera and the service. So where would I like to go? I'd love to do Machu Picchu. I'd love to do the Sadhana Forest in Pondicherry. I'd love to do just so many places, too many to count.
Speaker 1:But yeah, either a spiritual or an adventurous holiday, I'd love to ask this question what word would your children use to describe you?
Speaker 2:So I'm going to share something, and I don't know how the viewers will view this, but my daughter often calls me a loose cannon.
Speaker 1:Ooh, my sons would call me that as well. They go, stop embarrassing me. That's what they do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I think loose cannon, because I'm still impulsive and I think it's just doing the fun stuff in the moment and sometimes embarrassing them. Yeah.
Speaker 1:And your son, because your daughter would call you a loose cannon. What would your son call you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, what would my son call me? My son would probably say sensitive intellectual. That's what he'd say.
Speaker 1:What's one of the most impulsive things you've ever done.
Speaker 2:Okay, we were courting, my husband and I were courting, and I was in Deblahlin, he was in Mumbai and you know, those days we had drunk calls. So we were on a call and I was talking on the telephone and I lived very close to a railway station. So the train went past and I suddenly thought I want to go and meet him and so I said, okay, see you later. I mean, you know, let's hang up. And he said, can't you talk a little longer? And I said, no, no, I've got work to do. And I put the phone down and I took a sling bag and packed in some clothes and went to the station and caught a train and within three and a half hours I was calling him from the station. He said come pick me up from the station, I'm here in Mumbai. So that's when you knew what you were up against here.
Speaker 1:I like that story actually, because it just shows that you haven't changed so from your young days, your impulsive nature, till today. Young teachers and leaders often ask you know and I don't think they all have the opportunity, like I do, to speak to someone like you with your level of wisdom they often ask what advice we would give, or you know, to them who are looking and aspiring to leadership. So I'm going to turn that question to you, nargis. What advice would you give to aspiring school leaders who want to climb the ranks the way you have, being principal now senior vice president of education for Gems? What advice would you give?
Speaker 2:So I think the advice would be in two parts, the first being really know yourself well. What makes you tick, what makes you angry, what makes you work harder, what motivates you. And when you know yourself, you really. That leads you to the second part of it, and that is take on every responsibility you are being given, embrace it, and however hard that makes you work, however many hours that you have to put in, because every responsibility you take on, every opportunity, teaches you something and makes, helps you acquire skill that you may not require immediately, but years down the line you will need it somewhere. And so that's just two bits. One is know yourself well enough so that you can give your 100% to what you do, and the other is I think you know, just embrace every opportunity that comes your way and do it well, yeah, and if they are currently in role, yeah.
Speaker 1:And if they say they're new to role and they're finding it a little bit of a challenge, do you have any words of wisdom for someone like that?
Speaker 2:I don't know if the words of wisdom are just through experience, and there certainly will be moments that are challenging. I don't think there's any job in the world that doesn't come with its own set of challenges, but I think if you find your right tribe but I go to somebody completely different when I'm stuck with something else or I need input or advice on that. So whichever run of the ladder you're on, I think it's just important for you to find your tribe who are going to support you. I say this to my team all the time when you're upset, when you're angry, or you're upset or you don't know what to do find your path.
Speaker 2:I say, if you're upset, go to the washroom, cry, wash your face and come out and don't let anybody know you've cried, but come out stronger. If you're mad at something, use your anger to your advantage. Do something about it and do it constructive. Find somebody who will tell you the truth and sometimes you need to hear the truth because you've got blind spots right and find your tribe who will hold that mirror up to you and let you know. Or, if you genuinely don't know what to do, upskill yourself and don't feel ashamed to say I need to upskill myself and find a way to do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, sound advice. Sound advice Gems Modern. What makes it special? It's been up there, as you know. Is it the only CBSC Outstanding? I see a CIS, I see a.
Speaker 2:CIS. Now we are an IB school right through your PYP, nyp, dp school.
Speaker 1:Ah, yes, because you guys moved over.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, yes. So what makes it special? I think so. I think obviously the teaching and learning is at a very rarefied level and we're very proud of that. But I think what makes the school tick is the warmth and the sense of belonging, the values, and I think we intentionally go about everything that we do, we do it with that lens and I think we demonstrate that very warmly with you. When you walk in, that's the first thing people say you know the wall, speak to us, they welcome us, everybody's with a smile, everybody welcomes us.
Speaker 2:And you can't fake that, lisa, you can't fake that. And that's my advice to parents when they're looking for a school. You know, sometimes they come in and they say so what kind of school? What curriculum school? I said, don't look for curriculum, don't look for you know, just go and go into the school and see. You know, are the children comfortable with that, with their teachers? How do the teachers engage with each other? Is that tension in the air? Is it a happy place to be? You know, that's what should guide you. The learning will happen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I tend to. I tend to. I actually agree with you. I think a lot of parents tend to look at the results, look at this, that which is, which are all important, but will your child be happy in the space? Will they come home buzzing? I moved my kids from one school to another because of my position, I can't say with schools, but now the school they're in, they're happy, and it might be less academic, even though they do well academically, but they're happier and I'm more content with the fact that my kids love going to school now and they enjoy being there with the people there and when they come home they're bouncing off the walls and that's something that I value more than pretty much anything else. Really, I want healthy, happy children. I really, I really appreciate your time. Before we, before we wrap the whole, the whole podcast up, I wanted to find out from you, sort of your kind of crystal ball vision when do you hope that we are going as it relates to education, as it relates to schools? What would be your wish?
Speaker 2:So I'm not speaking on behalf of gems, not speaking on behalf of modern and speaking on my behalf, right, yes, of course, putting this out there. So I would love to see a school where assessment isn't given as much important, you know, not in the sense in the format in which it's high stakes, right, and for children as well. And I think children learn best when they're happy, as you say, and when they, when their expectations for the children are high, when their personalized pathways, without a drill and grill, you know where they're exploring and and there's a joy in the learning. And all of that is happening in our schools. Of course it is. But I'd love to see technology being used mindfully and I'd love to see more of an emotional and social connect, you know, among children and, again, values based education, because technology is, I mean, artificial intelligence, is just taking over, isn't it? But to have the emotional intelligence to handle all of this, I think you know all of positive psychology, all of Martin Seligman and all of the work that's come out of UPenn tells us that you know, when children are happy, they are learning at their best and and I don't mean happy as in, as in, just a giggly, laughy kind of happy yeah, where the well-being is at the core of, where they're being challenged, they're flourishing, they're, you know, enjoying what they're doing. I'd love to see children free of any kind of pressures and tensions and because this is we live in a, in a world that's changing so rapidly, no one has any formula, formula anymore for anything and everything is volatile, right. So something to anchor and ground the children, you know, in terms of knowing who they are.
Speaker 2:And I think, taking us back to basics, I think I'm not romanticizing this, but I think you know when, in the good old days and I'm talking of, you know, the apprenticeship model, I'm talking about the good to cool model and early on, when there was joy in learning what you're learning and the freedom to explore without the pressure of performance, and and all of that.
Speaker 2:So I've spoken as myself and the individual, not as the educator, not as the principal, and I hope that distinction is made because, as principal, I know that the principal is not the principal. I mean, there are, of course, you know, have to salute the UAE, I think in a, and this might sound controversial, but I think the, the, the annual inspections, have actually helped schools grow over the years. I know it's helped our school grow over the years and very mindfully grow the feedback that we have it's great, the national agenda that's come out and you know we have targets that you're working towards and and it just raises standards, which is great and which is fine and which is how it should be. But I think, looking into the future, but so much of technology, the mindful use of tech and just making sure children are children.
Speaker 1:Yes, I like that. Thank you so much, nargis, for being on the podcast. My pleasure, it's a pleasure. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2:You're welcome.
